Disturbing Trend

emmanuelle · 08-23-2003, 07:14 PM

We all know that reality sites have been all the rage for the past year or so. Are producers running out of fresh ideas?

I'm noticing that the newer sites, in their quest for originality are featuring scenarios that contain disturbing underlying themes. Mainly abuse of power & position, or simple taking advantage of women under duress.

Soldiers raping Iraqi women.
Cops screwing the women they've arrested.
Phony Immigration officials telling illegal immigrants to "fuck or get deported"
Women who cannot pay their rent having to fuck the landlord in order to not be evicted.
The list goes on.........

What ever happened to sex being fun, and porn being about fantasy situations? Do we really need to sink so low? Who is buying this crap anyway?

wsjb78 · 08-23-2003, 07:34 PM

It's the same with tv and entertainment in general... ppl have no new ideas....

Panky · 08-23-2003, 07:57 PM

This stuff goes on in real life.

You can choose to watch it, or choose not to watch it. It's still going to continue cuz people will watch it and buy it.

Why do people always flock to an automobile accident , or a crime scene where someone was murdered and just stand around and stare?

Why do people watch shows like Jerry Springer or Cops?

Ever notice the more gory and disgusting something is, the more people will look?

Curiosity maybe? Maybe we feel better cuz it's not ourselves lying there bleeding?

Maybe some of the porn is acting out a fantasy for us?

susannas · 08-23-2003, 08:57 PM

I agree the "trend" is disturbing... for me what is out there now is right on the border of morality... on occasion some text on these tours crosses the line of r*pe which we all would agree is not cool. So is r*pe fantasy okay to portrait because it "is providing the fantasy for people" thereby keeping them from playing out their fantasies? Does simulated CP therefore make sense? I don't think anyone would agree.

I believe that the "trend" is disturbing because I have little faith that webmasters know where to stop. I am not a prude and possibly I have some kinks that are just as hardcore but its extremely important to me that I know where to draw the line with making images and text that influence other peoples morality...especially young people's morality.

I wonder... do you think all of America acts like the people on Jerry Springer? Not long ago I was in Holland and everyone there loved to watch Jerry Springer... they thought everyone in America acted like those on there. Even Big Brother originated in Holland... they invented reality shows. Course Holland didnt have to invent reality porn because their sexuality is light years ahead of ours in so many ways. Thats for another post....

I wonder what happens when men are highly degraded in porn. When we get so far as to say "this dumb fuck cant even get a fucking erection so I had to beat the fuck out of him and spread his asshole wider then his mouth with my strap on... " heck thats even mild...

Its a tough subject that I have debated before as well... next will come those that say "grow up you work in porn for fuck sakes" ya da ya da None of that makes simulated r*pe okay. Date r*pe drugs... sites that basically encourage that kind of borderline behaviour... celebrate it...

I dont think we need to go there in order to "cover all bases of entertainment" its all about money... not morality... and that is not a good thing.

Ronaldo · 08-24-2003, 02:18 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by wsjb78
It's the same with tv and entertainment in general... ppl have no new ideas....

Amen.

I used to get pissed off at all of these ridiculous reality shows until I sat and thought about it. People are watching it. There must be a demand for it.

I'm no longer pissed off at the TV executives (*Please note-only this instance. TV executives are truly the scum of the earth, next to lawyers) for producing this product. How many of us make money because there is a demand for our product?

emmanuelle · 08-24-2003, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ronaldo

How many of us make money because there is a demand for our product?

Promoting it = Supporting it.

I make plenty of $ without supporting degradation, abuse, and non-consensual sex.

Perhaps when the industry starts behaving a little more responsibly, then the industry might be taken a little more seriously.

susannas · 08-24-2003, 11:56 AM

We all make money because there is a demand for our product... but though I dont know the numbers I am sure there is a demand for spousal murder but its not going to be the business of choice for 99.99999% of people just cause there is money in it LOL

kassidy · 08-24-2003, 12:47 PM

The whole trend disgusts me. The sad thing is, that if we, as an industry, don't start censoring ourselves, someone else will do it for us. Sure, the laws are different in Canada than they are in the US...for now. If the US starts to take a serious stance on porn, I can easily see Canada following suit shortly thereafter.

The webmasters who promote the sites are just as guilty as the producers themselves.

It really concerns me that there is a market for it at all, but there must be if they're working hard to produce more and more of this type of content.

Evil Chris · 08-24-2003, 12:48 PM

Emma, I don't believe this *trend* is current at all.

Porn has and unfortunately always will exploit women for profit at one level or another. Each and every one of us has their line in the sand so to speak about it. What one person (man or woman) finds acceptable, another won't.

susannas · 08-24-2003, 01:00 PM

Evil Chris

I think thats the point I make! that there is no line drawn for us... This is also a world stage... and for the most part it is not canadians or americans crossing the line into non consentual... the one site I really disliked had disclaimers around on the tour that said this was fantasy... but nothing about "this is illegal if you try it at home"

I worry what is next... retarded people porn? would that not finally cause a stir?

emmanuelle · 08-24-2003, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by susannas
Evil Chris

I worry what is next... retarded people porn? would that not finally cause a stir?

How about white men forcing black women with a southern theme?

I believe that would be an equally parallel scenario, however people seem to know better than to touch it.

Can I please get a map of where that particular line is drawn?

emmanuelle · 08-24-2003, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Evil Chris
Emma, I don't believe this *trend* is current at all.

Porn has and unfortunately always will exploit women for profit at one level or another. Each and every one of us has their line in the sand so to speak about it. What one person (man or woman) finds acceptable, another won't.

Chris- I think that you are confusing the alleged sexploitation of women in the industry with my original point.

These producers are dreaming up scenarios that focus on the abuse of women in unfortunate situations. They glorify it, and treat it as 'cool'.

These sites don't have to portray the situations as they are. With a little imagination, they could easily turn it into something fun, instead of brutal.

What is wrong with a situation like the telephone repair man satisfying all the lonely, horny housewives he encounters all day long?
It's the same premise- Joe Blow gets all the chicks, and he's a hero to the viewers, instead of a villian. It's even something that viewers can relate to, and it's a realistic fantasy.

susannas · 08-24-2003, 01:35 PM

We should probably stop as we are giving some people ideas! thats not really meant as sarcasm either.

But its interesting that your right. Only after history proves what happens does common man know better then to support that kind of thinking...So until women stop trusting men we will continue to be raped. What will the world look like when we stop trusting men?

I know I read something just a few days ago about how women will be able to reproduce without the male species and in like 25 years there will be no more male female relationships. Who knows. I wonder if women would rape other women. Or are women the only species on earth with empathy?

I know that 99% of men are not forcing women into sex and all men reading this will probably say "i have empathy" but we see time and time again the decisions of men...war...revenge...abuse of power all based on lack of empathy.

Anyways I am not really a feminist... just concerned for the human race like the next person....Lack of speaking out on things that are detrimental to the human race is the same as supporting it. Kudos to Emmanuelle for this thread.

susannas · 08-24-2003, 01:42 PM

Emmanuelle

The site that really got me going was entirely focused on date r*pe. Finding a gal in the bar getting her drunk taking her home, fucking her while she was passed out and EVEN worry that she might remember what he did to her and celebrating that she didnt remember.

THAT to me is worse then a plain outright r*pe site...believe it or not. Because it plays on young men who want to act that way and they are just learning their own morals. They are learning how to treat women (and other men) and they will be tempted by such a site... their buddies say here here is some date r*pe drugs... np you get exactly what you want when you use these.....THIS is reality... its not happening in some far off city... its happening in EVERY city.

pornodoggy · 08-24-2003, 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by emmanuelle
Promoting it = Supporting it.

I make plenty of $ without supporting degradation, abuse, and non-consensual sex.

Perhaps when the industry starts behaving a little more responsibly, then the industry might be taken a little more seriously.

I agree with the first two paragraphs whole-heartedly.

I don't think the industry will ever be taken seriously by mainstream, however. Merely "taking us seriously" would imply a degree of endorsement, at least among the bible-thumping crowd, that would cost more than most people would be willing to pay.

-=HUNGRYMAN=- · 08-24-2003, 03:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by emmanuelle
How about white men forcing black women with a southern theme?

I might even sign up for that site .... LMAO !!

sorry .. very good points being made by all parties here ..

but a reverse twist on Blacoks on Blondes would be funny as hell !!!

(at the end of the scene, you could have some HUGE, gold chain wearing d00d burst in and scream "Wut da fukk you dwin wit my baby mutha !!!")

OK .. I'm definately going to hell now!

Magnus3x · 08-24-2003, 03:31 PM

Quote:

What ever happened to sex being fun, and porn being about fantasy situations? Do we really need to sink so low? Who is buying this crap anyway?

Ummmmmmmmmm...yeah no one is buying them, thats why fistinglessons.com convert anywhere from 1:55 to 1:300 on plain ol TGP traffic, consistantly across the board and retention on this content is very sticky.
I wont roll with R*pe...KP...or Inc*st and that is a moral given. I agree some of the newer reality sites are in very poor taste, but I don't and wont judge!
The average person who does not agree with pornography and thinks we will all go to hell with Pee Wee Herman does'nt care if you are Playboy....a softcore cutsie amateur cam girl...or someone getting fisted and pissed on, to them this is all PORN!

Easton · 08-24-2003, 03:37 PM

like i always say when this issue arises: if it's all legal, then there is no problem

it is merely porn refelcting our current society's tastes...

susannas · 08-24-2003, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Easton
like i always say when this issue arises: if it's all legal, then there is no problem

it is merely porn refelcting our current society's tastes...

Says who? I really would like to know. Example. Tell me where the niche cumming on a womans face came from? Seriously....men speak up here if you were born with that kink? Did you one day say ohhh I want to see my cum on a womans face... NO IT came from porn saying heh this is cool you will like this...

Same goes for all the stuff out there...curiosity gets them in. Then it teaches them to get off on it.

AND to each his own if someone likes to force another for sex then find a partner that likes to be forced...play or not that is concentual sex. The sites we are talking about is non concentual and fuck me if that is what society's tastes are these days.

ALSO fistinglessons.com is not distasteful. They do not talk about non consentual anything. If you check out any of the content the women are enjoying it emensely. Same with the big cock sex sites. All consentual. I have done a test to see if female traffic likes fistinglessons and it converts as well as 1 in 200.

Magnus you do judge... dont hand out that crap. You have to because you are saying you do have a line in the sand and its drawn at anything cp or r*pe related.

I dont judge what two consenting adults want to do. Infact I celebrate it and admire some of the things that turn others on. I will judge when someone is abusing another. Full Stop. and Magnus so do you.

Seth · 08-24-2003, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Promoting it = Supporting it.

I make plenty of $ without supporting degradation, abuse, and non-consensual sex.

Perhaps when the industry starts behaving a little more responsibly, then the industry might be taken a little more seriously.

Exactly. That's why I/we never have and never will support, promote or link with such sites. There is too much other stuff out there to promote and make money from.

Not just the r*pe and date r*pe type sites, but IMO forced sex via blackmail/extortion is r*pe, also. Maybe not physical r*pe but emotional and/or mental r*pe. Leaving the woman feeling that he/they may come back at any time and demand more. Yes I know the sites aren't real, but if it gives ONE idiot out there the idea that it's ok. That's one to many.

Is it our responsibility to police these things? No. But it IS our choice and in the end... we as webmasters.... as human beings.... have to live with our choices and if we say no.... and don't support these sites.... they will fade away.

Panky · 08-24-2003, 06:04 PM

Easton is right. Ever wonder where the idea came from in the first place that anal was kewl, cumming on a woman's face was kewl, blowjobs, fisting ,...?

This stuff has been going on since the beginning of the human race. People don't need porn to become creative in the bedroom. Someone had to think this stuff up in the first place. Look at Marquis DeSade. He didn't need porn sites to enhance a desire that was already there. Some sex machines were patented in the US in the early 1900's. Probably long before that in Asia. The Bible even contains stories dealing with sex. The scenes dipicted in porn films are not new ideas. People were doing this stuff long before the technology for a photograph and film were ever invented.

People who use date rape drugs, take advantage of an intoxicated person, participate in gang rape..., don't do this stuff cuz they saw it on a porn film. There is an underlying desire already there. Maybe it's ego power trip thing, maybe it's because they themselves were sexually abused, whatever the cause, it goes much deeper than viewing porn. Porn is not responsible for society and it's behavior. Porn just happens to be what people turn to when they need to pass the blame and justify their actions.

People want this stuff. People get off on it. That's why they buy it. Porn is a just a means of giving people what they want.

SykkBoy · 08-25-2003, 09:36 PM

Man, I wish we could just get rid of nudity period.

Everyone in this business should be forced to have nothing more revealing than a one-piece bikini.

There should never even be any sexuals acts alluded to unless the models are married and doing it for pro-creation ONLY.

Oops, sorry, my grandmother's morals invaded me for a minute......imagine if she was in charge of drawing the line in the sand for all of us.....

emmanuelle · 08-25-2003, 09:58 PM

It saddens me that you boys just don't get it.
There is nothing titillating about non-consensual sex.

Ronaldo · 08-25-2003, 10:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by emmanuelle
Promoting it = Supporting it.

I make plenty of $ without supporting degradation, abuse, and non-consensual sex.

Perhaps when the industry starts behaving a little more responsibly, then the industry might be taken a little more seriously.

Hmm, just noticed this.

I hope you read who I was quoting and to what I was referring, because I in no way support rape or degrading sites either.

I make plenty of $ as well without supporting or promoting it.

Ronaldo · 08-25-2003, 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by emmanuelle
There is nothing titillating about non-consensual sex.

I don't find anything titillating about non-consensual sex either but I can't make the same statement as you have.

I can only speak for myself.

That would be like me saying that "There is nothing titillating about Asian women". I don't particularly find Asian women attractive, but that's a preference. Others DO find them attractive and titillating so my statement would be incorrect.

My statement should read "I find nothing titillating about Asian women".

susannas · 08-25-2003, 10:26 PM

Get a grip on reality Renaldo. LMFAO

Thats like saying you cannot speak out against the guy that murdered your wife or r*ped her either. We all have to stand up for what is wrong. Cutting some guys dick off becuase he was a bad witto boy is also wrong. Doesnt matter if it was tittilating to the wife or not.

Sykk your grammas morals have nothing to do with non consentual sex... you of all people know the difference.

SykkBoy · 08-25-2003, 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by emmanuelle
It saddens me that you boys just don't get it.
There is nothing titillating about non-consensual sex.

I don't find a crackwhore showing pink titillating either, but it's all over the web.....

SykkBoy · 08-25-2003, 10:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by susannas

Sykk your grammas morals have nothing to do with non consentual sex... you of all people know the difference.

no, but people want to draw a line in the sand for everyone else, why would my grandmother's line be any less valid than yours or mine?

Ronaldo · 08-25-2003, 10:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by susannas
Get a grip on reality Renaldo. LMFAO

Thats like saying you cannot speak out against the guy that murdered your wife or r*ped her either. We all have to stand up for what is wrong. Cutting some guys dick off becuase he was a bad witto boy is also wrong. Doesnt matter if it was tittilating to the wife or not.

Sykk your grammas morals have nothing to do with non consentual sex... you of all people know the difference.

I didn't say that she couldn't or shouldn't speak out against it. I live in a semi-free country as does emmanuelle I believe.

I also didn't say whether non-consensual sex was right or wrong. Perhaps this was an oversight on my part. I think non-consensual sex is wrong.

However, as sick and depraved as you and I may find it, I'm also not arrogant enough to believe that MY beliefs are the CORRECT beliefs. To make a blanket statement that the entire world should agree with, because I believe it, is also wrong. Not as wrong as I believe non-consensual sex to be, but wrong nonetheless.

susannas · 08-25-2003, 11:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ronaldo
I didn't say that she couldn't or shouldn't speak out against it. I live in a semi-free country as does emmanuelle I believe.

I also didn't say whether non-consensual sex was right or wrong. Perhaps this was an oversight on my part. I think non-consensual sex is wrong.

However, as sick and depraved as you and I may find it, I'm also not arrogant enough to believe that MY beliefs are the CORRECT beliefs. To make a blanket statement that the entire world should agree with, because I believe it, is also wrong. Not as wrong as I believe non-consensual sex to be, but wrong nonetheless.

Renaldo no matter how Canadian you want to be there has to be rights and wrongs or else there is Caos.

Do you really want such a free society that teaches its young boys that its okay to date rape your daughter?